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Is Taylor Swift our greatest living poet-philosopher?

Consider her latest album, Red. In it, she discourses on th...
phi beta cappuccino
  03/24/13
"She is both Socrates and Diotima, Dante's Beatrice and...
,,.,.,.,.,....;,.,:,.,.,.,..,...,..:...,.;
  03/24/13
This is good. Where did you steal it from?
Warren Wilhelm, Jr.
  03/25/13
I think he stole it from American Psycho, the book. I haven...
blipbloop
  03/25/13
I was loosely parodying the Whitney Houston chapter for tone...
phi beta cappuccino
  03/26/13
180
Bro Montpellier
  04/04/14
...
MPA (retired due to anti-Irish racism)
  11/15/16
Who did she break up with this time?
~~(>' ' )>
  03/24/13
all of her bfs dump her because she's a frigid dyke
Benzo
  03/24/13
lol have you seen the dudes she dates? Frigid dyke isn't th...
phi beta cappuccino
  03/24/13
What's the problem then?
,,.,...,..,.,.,:.,:,...,::,.,.,:,.,.:.,:.,:.::,.,
  07/04/13
This is pure speculation of course but I'm going with roast ...
chilmata
  04/04/14
Talk to your kids about UGLY VAGINA
....,,....,,.,.,,.,,....,..
  04/04/14
yes brother, she was the first human being to genuinely unit...
.;.;..;;;;........................,.,.,.,.,.,.,;.
  03/24/13
That contribution can't be underestimated. She certainly ha...
phi beta cappuccino
  03/24/13
...
.........,,;,;,;,,,............,,;,;;,.;.
  03/24/13
lol what
BuffNigger
  03/25/13
poetry and philo are mutually exclusive, hth
dcpoast (41 yr old shirtless guitar player)
  03/25/13
Fuck off, Socrates. You couldn't even troll Thrasybulus wit...
phi beta cappuccino
  03/26/13
...
Fix You
  07/04/13
I realize this is not serious, but she honestly is the most ...
,.,.,.,.,,,,,.,,,.,.,...,,.,.,.,.,.,.,.,.,.,.,.
  03/25/13
She's not a talented songwriter. All of her songs fit the ba...
.,.,...,..,.,..:,,:,...,:::,...,:,.,.:..:.,:,::,.
  03/26/13
hey guess what songwriter =/= lyricist
we never change, do we
  04/30/13
...
we never change, do we
  03/25/13
I see now that you are Estrada.
ljl
  03/25/13
bad read imo.
Yeah they were all yellow
  04/04/14
180
Would I Lie To You Baby?
  03/26/13
one hundred and eighty
.,,.....,.,.,.,:,,:,,.:,:::.,,.,:,.,.:.:.,:.::,.
  03/26/13
bump
,,.,.,.,.,....;,.,:,.,.,.,..,...,..:...,.;
  04/13/13
op needs to do kendrick lamar's album
T1GER Woods
  04/13/13
...
Bro Montpellier
  04/04/14
http://www.reddit.com/r/AskReddit/comments/1dpph8/is_taylor_...
,,.,.,.,.,....;,.,:,.,.,.,..,...,..:...,.;
  05/05/13
easily
sealclubber
  05/05/13
bump
,,.,.,.,.,....;,.,:,.,.,.,..,...,..:...,.;
  06/29/13
much deserved 180
BenSpanklin
  06/29/13
...
,,.,.,.,.,....;,.,:,.,.,.,..,...,..:...,.;
  07/03/13
have a good life, millenials
fuck off
  07/03/13
killself
,.,,.,,.,,.,.,:,,:.,..,.::,...,:,.,.:...:.,:.;..,.
  07/03/13
go away peter
...,..,.,.,:,.:,.,.,:.:,..,..,:,.,.:.:.,:.::,..;,
  07/03/13
go away peter
...,..,.,.,:,.:,.,.,:.:,..,..,:,.,.:.:.,:.::,..;,
  07/03/13
lol jewel pwns her in every way
John_Kelly
  07/04/13
BAM! Blowjob from Taylor or Jewel. Who do you choose?
Fix You
  07/04/13
that's a tough q probably jewel
John_Kelly
  07/04/13
180
.,.,,..,..,.,.,:,,:,.,.,:,...,:,.,.:...:.:.::,..,,
  12/26/13
180
TedCruz the wise
  03/28/14
lana del rey hth
hizzlaa
  03/28/14
Joanna Newsom or gtfo
Boichester United
  04/04/14
...
TedCruz the wise
  04/04/14
nice poast, man
hacked214251
  04/04/14
180 and "the deceptive audacity of REO Speedwagon"...
Boichester United
  04/04/14
...
.,,.,...,,......,,.,,,.,.,.,.,.,.,,.
  04/04/14
op is bob woodward pu right? pure scholarship
Yeah they were all yellow
  04/04/14
...
Taylor Swift is not a hobby she is a lifestyle
  04/04/14
...
arhat
  09/12/15
...
tedcruztp
  10/01/15
Fuck me I love threads like these.
Gogul Gangoly
  10/01/15
...
.,,...,,...,.,,,..,,,,,..,...,,,.,.,,.,.,..,
  01/10/16
...
,.,;,.;,..,.;,.,.,;,.;,.,;,;.,.,,.,
  05/27/16
...
scholarship
  05/27/16
...
,,.,.,.,.,....;,.,:,.,.,.,..,...,..:...,.;
  11/14/16
...
Grimes
  11/14/16
Just imagine Patrick Bateman going through this entire spiel...
.,.,...,;..,.,.,:,,:,...,:::,.,.,:,,,.:.,:.,:.::,.
  11/15/16
S/T to Red may be the greatest 4-album compendium of emo lyr...
Wilbur Mercer, man in miniature
  11/15/16
...
Wilbur Mercer, man in miniature
  08/10/17
I could read these all day everyday
pepito
  11/15/16
...
Thanks Mario! But our partner is in another castle
  08/10/17
...
CapTTTainFalcon
  08/25/17
...
twins
  08/25/17


Poast new message in this thread



Reply Favorite

Date: March 24th, 2013 6:31 PM
Author: phi beta cappuccino (extra like the olive oil)

Consider her latest album, Red. In it, she discourses on the five traditional branches of philosophy: metaphysics ("Everything Has Changed"), epistemology ("I Knew You Were Trouble"), logic ("Begin Again"), aesthetics ("Sad Beautiful Tragic"), and ethics ("We Are Never Ever Getting Back Together"). But she invigilates these categories ruthlessly in her opus on the futility of human action ("I Almost Do"), her paean to faith against reason ("State of Grace"), and her enigmatic Socratic dialogue on Western decline ("The Last Time", featuring Gary Lightbody of Snow Patrol).

Just as Bob Dylan used his nasal whine to focus our moral attention on the everyday details of life, like race riots and police shootings, Taylor Swift uses her flinty, almost Canadian voice to assure us that her songs are trite morality plays, artifice based in part on a true story. Without either the utopian simplicity of The Eagles or the deceptive audacity of REO Speedwagon, she needs the mask of biographical incident to disguise the disturbing implications of her radical skepticism. Does she believe the world floats on the back of a turtle? Who knows? We'll have to wait for the Playboy interview.

Taylor Swift's artificiality is not unique in pop music. She plays America's fag hag, just as Justin Beiber plays an eternally molested child, right down to his milksop Christianity, and Nicki Minaj confirms every stereotype about transgendered prostitutes from Queens. These archetypes give us a means of confronting the confusion and despair of post-industrial life. We have strangled the last king with the entrails of the last priest, but we still want authority and we still want absolution. Enter Taylor Swift, herself innocent yet confessional, forgiving every deviance yet relentlessly preserving them for the record in surprisingly catchy tunes. She is both Socrates and Diotima, Dante's Beatrice and Milton's Uriel.

So, to answer the question which motivates this poast: is Taylor Swift our greatest living poet-philosopher? No, that's probably Michael Sandel.

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=2213084&forum_id=2#22873831)



Reply Favorite

Date: March 24th, 2013 10:07 PM
Author: ,,.,.,.,.,....;,.,:,.,.,.,..,...,..:...,.;


"She is both Socrates and Diotima, Dante's Beatrice and Milton's Uriel."

180

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=2213084&forum_id=2#22875404)



Reply Favorite

Date: March 25th, 2013 4:15 PM
Author: Warren Wilhelm, Jr.

This is good. Where did you steal it from?

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=2213084&forum_id=2#22878953)



Reply Favorite

Date: March 25th, 2013 4:17 PM
Author: blipbloop

I think he stole it from American Psycho, the book. I haven't read the book in years but an entire chapter was written about Whitney Houston. I would be surprised if OP replaced Whitney Houston and Whitney Houston song's with Taylor Swift and Taylor Swift songs.

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=2213084&forum_id=2#22878961)



Reply Favorite

Date: March 26th, 2013 3:05 AM
Author: phi beta cappuccino (extra like the olive oil)

I was loosely parodying the Whitney Houston chapter for tone, but it's not exactly the same.

Here's the chapter, btw.

http://www.whitney-fan.com/forums/index.php?showtopic=4434

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=2213084&forum_id=2#22882086)



Reply Favorite

Date: April 4th, 2014 2:40 PM
Author: Bro Montpellier

180

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=2213084&forum_id=2#25322967)



Reply Favorite

Date: November 15th, 2016 10:25 AM
Author: MPA (retired due to anti-Irish racism) (trainandpuppetshow@gmail.com. )



(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=2213084&forum_id=2#31913521)



Reply Favorite

Date: March 24th, 2013 6:33 PM
Author: ~~(>' ' )>

Who did she break up with this time?

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=2213084&forum_id=2#22873849)



Reply Favorite

Date: March 24th, 2013 6:35 PM
Author: Benzo (108.254.180.122)

all of her bfs dump her because she's a frigid dyke

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=2213084&forum_id=2#22873855)



Reply Favorite

Date: March 24th, 2013 6:42 PM
Author: phi beta cappuccino (extra like the olive oil)

lol have you seen the dudes she dates? Frigid dyke isn't the problem.

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=2213084&forum_id=2#22873907)



Reply Favorite

Date: July 4th, 2013 1:33 AM
Author: ,,.,...,..,.,.,:.,:,...,::,.,.,:,.,.:.,:.,:.::,.,


What's the problem then?

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=2213084&forum_id=2#23543747)



Reply Favorite

Date: April 4th, 2014 10:28 AM
Author: chilmata

This is pure speculation of course but I'm going with roast beef curtains.

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=2213084&forum_id=2#25321488)



Reply Favorite

Date: April 4th, 2014 10:33 AM
Author: ....,,....,,.,.,,.,,....,..


Talk to your kids about UGLY VAGINA

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=2213084&forum_id=2#25321512)



Reply Favorite

Date: March 24th, 2013 6:55 PM
Author: .;.;..;;;;........................,.,.,.,.,.,.,;.


yes brother, she was the first human being to genuinely unite analytic and continental philosophy. greatest SCHOLAR of our age!

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=2213084&forum_id=2#22873968)



Reply Favorite

Date: March 24th, 2013 9:44 PM
Author: phi beta cappuccino (extra like the olive oil)

That contribution can't be underestimated. She certainly has been cucked enough times to qualify as a premier intellectual.

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=2213084&forum_id=2#22875202)



Reply Favorite

Date: March 24th, 2013 10:04 PM
Author: .........,,;,;,;,,,............,,;,;;,.;.




(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=2213084&forum_id=2#22875376)



Reply Favorite

Date: March 25th, 2013 4:23 PM
Author: BuffNigger

lol what

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=2213084&forum_id=2#22878983)



Reply Favorite

Date: March 25th, 2013 4:23 PM
Author: dcpoast (41 yr old shirtless guitar player)

poetry and philo are mutually exclusive, hth

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=2213084&forum_id=2#22878988)



Reply Favorite

Date: March 26th, 2013 2:55 AM
Author: phi beta cappuccino (extra like the olive oil)

Fuck off, Socrates. You couldn't even troll Thrasybulus without breathlessly quoting Aeschylus.

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=2213084&forum_id=2#22882072)



Reply Favorite

Date: July 4th, 2013 1:30 AM
Author: Fix You



(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=2213084&forum_id=2#23543735)



Reply Favorite

Date: March 25th, 2013 4:25 PM
Author: ,.,.,.,.,,,,,.,,,.,.,...,,.,.,.,.,.,.,.,.,.,.,.


I realize this is not serious, but she honestly is the most talented song-writer/singer to come along in a long time. Some of the stuff she's done that is not even well known is pretty brilliant, e.g.:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TzJlpnBaJyw

She's still a very flawed person, but her talent is off the charts.

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=2213084&forum_id=2#22878995)



Reply Favorite

Date: March 26th, 2013 8:28 AM
Author: .,.,...,..,.,..:,,:,...,:::,...,:,.,.:..:.,:,::,.


She's not a talented songwriter. All of her songs fit the basic template of "rowdy rebellious teen" "wistful ex lover longing for *home*,"hopeful lover," and "nostalgic youth longing for even more youth." They're tropes in pop music that she and her team are clever enough to exploit. Doesn't make her a talented song writer.

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=2213084&forum_id=2#22882297)



Reply Favorite

Date: April 30th, 2013 9:59 PM
Author: we never change, do we

hey guess what songwriter =/= lyricist

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=2213084&forum_id=2#23110207)



Reply Favorite

Date: March 25th, 2013 4:37 PM
Author: we never change, do we



(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=2213084&forum_id=2#22879053)



Reply Favorite

Date: March 25th, 2013 4:37 PM
Author: ljl

I see now that you are Estrada.

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=2213084&forum_id=2#22879054)



Reply Favorite

Date: April 4th, 2014 1:45 PM
Author: Yeah they were all yellow

bad read imo.

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=2213084&forum_id=2#25322525)



Reply Favorite

Date: March 26th, 2013 5:17 AM
Author: Would I Lie To You Baby?

180

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=2213084&forum_id=2#22882175)



Reply Favorite

Date: March 26th, 2013 8:37 AM
Author: .,,.....,.,.,.,:,,:,,.:,:::.,,.,:,.,.:.:.,:.::,.


one hundred and eighty

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=2213084&forum_id=2#22882306)



Reply Favorite

Date: April 13th, 2013 3:15 AM
Author: ,,.,.,.,.,....;,.,:,.,.,.,..,...,..:...,.;


bump

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=2213084&forum_id=2#22988737)



Reply Favorite

Date: April 13th, 2013 3:38 AM
Author: T1GER Woods

op needs to do kendrick lamar's album

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=2213084&forum_id=2#22988776)



Reply Favorite

Date: April 4th, 2014 2:41 PM
Author: Bro Montpellier



(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=2213084&forum_id=2#25322979)



Reply Favorite

Date: May 5th, 2013 12:17 PM
Author: ,,.,.,.,.,....;,.,:,.,.,.,..,...,..:...,.;


http://www.reddit.com/r/AskReddit/comments/1dpph8/is_taylor_swift_our_greatest_living/

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=2213084&forum_id=2#23137712)



Reply Favorite

Date: May 5th, 2013 12:39 PM
Author: sealclubber

easily

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=2213084&forum_id=2#23137813)



Reply Favorite

Date: June 29th, 2013 5:12 PM
Author: ,,.,.,.,.,....;,.,:,.,.,.,..,...,..:...,.;


bump

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=2213084&forum_id=2#23503332)



Reply Favorite

Date: June 29th, 2013 5:26 PM
Author: BenSpanklin

much deserved 180

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=2213084&forum_id=2#23503409)



Reply Favorite

Date: July 3rd, 2013 12:26 AM
Author: ,,.,.,.,.,....;,.,:,.,.,.,..,...,..:...,.;




(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=2213084&forum_id=2#23528396)



Reply Favorite

Date: July 3rd, 2013 12:30 AM
Author: fuck off

have a good life, millenials

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=2213084&forum_id=2#23528464)



Reply Favorite

Date: July 3rd, 2013 12:31 AM
Author: ,.,,.,,.,,.,.,:,,:.,..,.::,...,:,.,.:...:.,:.;..,.


killself

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=2213084&forum_id=2#23528471)



Reply Favorite

Date: July 3rd, 2013 9:34 PM
Author: ...,..,.,.,:,.:,.,.,:.:,..,..,:,.,.:.:.,:.::,..;,


go away peter

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=2213084&forum_id=2#23541761)



Reply Favorite

Date: July 3rd, 2013 9:34 PM
Author: ...,..,.,.,:,.:,.,.,:.:,..,..,:,.,.:.:.,:.::,..;,


go away peter

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=2213084&forum_id=2#23541762)



Reply Favorite

Date: July 4th, 2013 1:29 AM
Author: John_Kelly

lol jewel pwns her in every way

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=2213084&forum_id=2#23543730)



Reply Favorite

Date: July 4th, 2013 1:31 AM
Author: Fix You

BAM! Blowjob from Taylor or Jewel. Who do you choose?

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=2213084&forum_id=2#23543737)



Reply Favorite

Date: July 4th, 2013 2:34 AM
Author: John_Kelly

that's a tough q

probably jewel

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=2213084&forum_id=2#23543981)



Reply Favorite

Date: December 26th, 2013 6:35 PM
Author: .,.,,..,..,.,.,:,,:,.,.,:,...,:,.,.:...:.:.::,..,, (tedcruz)


180

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=2213084&forum_id=2#24716751)



Reply Favorite

Date: March 28th, 2014 11:33 AM
Author: TedCruz the wise

180

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=2213084&forum_id=2#25277665)



Reply Favorite

Date: March 28th, 2014 11:38 AM
Author: hizzlaa

lana del rey hth

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=2213084&forum_id=2#25277687)



Reply Favorite

Date: April 4th, 2014 10:24 AM
Author: Boichester United (cool god man wandering the flesh realm)

Joanna Newsom or gtfo

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=2213084&forum_id=2#25321472)



Reply Favorite

Date: April 4th, 2014 10:21 AM
Author: TedCruz the wise



(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=2213084&forum_id=2#25321456)



Reply Favorite

Date: April 4th, 2014 10:27 AM
Author: hacked214251

nice poast, man

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=2213084&forum_id=2#25321486)



Reply Favorite

Date: April 4th, 2014 10:30 AM
Author: Boichester United (cool god man wandering the flesh realm)

180 and "the deceptive audacity of REO Speedwagon" would be a great moniker.

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=2213084&forum_id=2#25321498)



Reply Favorite

Date: April 4th, 2014 1:33 PM
Author: .,,.,...,,......,,.,,,.,.,.,.,.,.,,.




(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=2213084&forum_id=2#25322449)



Reply Favorite

Date: April 4th, 2014 1:44 PM
Author: Yeah they were all yellow

op is bob woodward pu right? pure scholarship

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=2213084&forum_id=2#25322523)



Reply Favorite

Date: April 4th, 2014 3:09 PM
Author: Taylor Swift is not a hobby she is a lifestyle



(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=2213084&forum_id=2#25323175)



Reply Favorite

Date: September 12th, 2015 3:18 PM
Author: arhat



(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=2213084&forum_id=2#28741244)



Reply Favorite

Date: October 1st, 2015 5:28 AM
Author: tedcruztp



(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=2213084&forum_id=2#28874107)



Reply Favorite

Date: October 1st, 2015 6:06 AM
Author: Gogul Gangoly

Fuck me I love threads like these.

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=2213084&forum_id=2#28874117)



Reply Favorite

Date: January 10th, 2016 8:26 PM
Author: .,,...,,...,.,,,..,,,,,..,...,,,.,.,,.,.,..,




(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=2213084&forum_id=2#29567339)



Reply Favorite

Date: May 27th, 2016 2:02 AM
Author: ,.,;,.;,..,.;,.,.,;,.;,.,;,;.,.,,.,




(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=2213084&forum_id=2#30568854)



Reply Favorite

Date: May 27th, 2016 2:06 AM
Author: scholarship



(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=2213084&forum_id=2#30568862)



Reply Favorite

Date: November 14th, 2016 6:40 PM
Author: ,,.,.,.,.,....;,.,:,.,.,.,..,...,..:...,.;




(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=2213084&forum_id=2#31908540)



Reply Favorite

Date: November 14th, 2016 6:56 PM
Author: Grimes



(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=2213084&forum_id=2#31908712)



Reply Favorite

Date: November 15th, 2016 10:25 AM
Author: .,.,...,;..,.,.,:,,:,...,:::,.,.,:,,,.:.,:.,:.::,.


Just imagine Patrick Bateman going through this entire spiel while playing a "I Knew You Were Trouble", just before he brutally murders people. What I'm saying is it's time for an American Psycho remake.

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=2213084&forum_id=2#31913515)



Reply Favorite

Date: November 15th, 2016 10:32 AM
Author: Wilbur Mercer, man in miniature (Wilbur Mercer)

S/T to Red may be the greatest 4-album compendium of emo lyricism of all time

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=2213084&forum_id=2#31913586)



Reply Favorite

Date: August 10th, 2017 12:55 PM
Author: Wilbur Mercer, man in miniature (Wilbur Mercer)



(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=2213084&forum_id=2#33957002)



Reply Favorite

Date: November 15th, 2016 10:34 AM
Author: pepito

I could read these all day everyday

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=2213084&forum_id=2#31913602)



Reply Favorite

Date: August 10th, 2017 12:53 PM
Author: Thanks Mario! But our partner is in another castle ( )



(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=2213084&forum_id=2#33956982)



Reply Favorite

Date: August 25th, 2017 2:38 PM
Author: CapTTTainFalcon



(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=2213084&forum_id=2#34066779)



Reply Favorite

Date: August 25th, 2017 2:41 PM
Author: twins



(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=2213084&forum_id=2#34066787)